Monday
Sep202010
Monday Open Thread
Monday, September 20, 2010 at 12:39PM
This week’s open thread is hosted by Most Fruitful Yuki. It’s been awhile since we’ve had an open thread. What’s happening?
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Reader Comments (31)
I would like to propose that we start replying to every spam comment (I sees them in my reader, scores and scores of them, you poor thing) in earnest.
"Why yes, I AM interested in these great deals on Uggs and Louboutin boots! However did you know I shared a passion for birth AND footwear?"
- or -
"I'm so glad you liked this very interesting (albeit posted 7 months ago) information, and that you plan to check back on this site often. Thanks for the 'good job!' encouragement."
Just for starters.
Competitive VBACing! Otherwise known as how I sometimes feel in birth circles.
http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7179353/
Dou-la-la, that is too funny. The spam situation has been making me want to fly to Indonesia and stop by South Korea on my way back. I can find them! They'll understand that they're annoying and they will stop.
Lele, I'll watch it later (can't watch it where I am).
What do you think of the new welcome page for Facebook? Welcome
I just read a very sad birth story. first time mom, failed induction, c-section. she feels so broken. she plans to have c-sections for future babies because her body clearly doesn't know how to birth. she blames the fact that she labored at all for why she feels (physically) horrible right now, and wants to avoid that in the future.
:(
I shared this thought the other day on my FB page, in a less than coherent manner. I heard a stat on NPR, that of all drivers who suvived fatal car accidents, those that were innocent in the crash were more likely to to suffer PTSD. A doctor (a psychologist, I think) explained that it was because these survivors had to face the fact that they were at the mercy of fate. I had birth-related PTSD following the birth of my son 17 months ago. In a few words, the show explained to me why my feelings of failure were so acute, and why for so long I have felt that my next birth will be a planned c-section -- I "failed" at birth because I couldn't control the process , but I could more easily control it if I choose to override it, to opt out of it from the beginning. I wanted to take fate out of the equation. It took me 17 months to figure that out, and now that I have, I realize that I CAN'T remove fate. It's scary, but it's liberating.
My local hospital (with scary c-section rate, induction rate etc etc) claims that their birthing pool is available, all midwives are trained in water birth, and that hospital policy does not prohibit birth in water (as opposed to only allowing labouring in water). Then how come, in a hospital with 6000 births a year, does only one woman a week on average labour or birth in the pool? It makes no sense! Thoughts, anyone?
Joanne -- my bet is that they place an IV on arrival by default, and then tell you that you can't get in the pool b/c of the IV.
Oh I've been dying to get this off my chest. A friend of mine recently had a scheduled c-section for suspected big baby--no diabetes, just an ultrasound estimate. She stressed that her CNM had gone over all the risks so I thought, okay whatever, as long as you know what you're getting into.
She just posted her birth story on her blog. She talks about how she was nervous before hand (of course) but I was BLOWN AWAY by this sentence (paraphrased): I was a little nervous because I've never had any medical procedures and a c-section is "technically a type of surgery." (that last part is not paraphrased)
HOW on EARTH could someone be informed of all the risks of an elective c-section if no one even bothered to tell her that it is MAJOR SURGERY????? It seems she was only told about the risks of vaginal birth. Of course you would choose c-section when you are told the horrors of possible shoulder dystocia and perineal trauma but led to believe that a c-section is a minor procedure that is "technically" surgery. Informed consent my ass.
It was her first baby and it absolutely breaks my heart. I'm praying that she doesn't have any lasting physical or emotional damage and that she gets a new provider for her next pregnancy that has the decency to tell her the truth.
BTW, baby was 9 lbs even.
I'm not normally the kind of gal to accuse people of misogyny. It makes it sound like I'm trying to shut down debate, so I tend to steer away from that approach. But lately, I can't help but ponder the inherent misogyny of medicalized birth.
Being a feminist (to me) means that I value the role and contribution that women are designed for--and so darned good at--so much that I'm willing to give up a promising career to fulfill that role. Obviously I don't begrudge anyone who chooses differently, but that's the premise that guides my own decisions.
Childbirth belongs to women. From a religious standpoint (I'm LDS) especially. (For other LDS, check out this article to see what I'm talking about: http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences/2010_The_Two_Trees.html). And yet what I see in medicalized childbirth is a bunch of (mostly) men trying to hijack birth from women--even having the gall to believe THEY can do it better than women can. I can't think of another way to describe it, except misogynistic! And yet those of us who oppose it are called "brave" at best, and "crazy" or "stupid" at worst. I don't understand why most people don't see it, or even why I didn't see it until so recently. What is blinding us to this abuse?
Anyway, I've been waiting for an open thread so I could get that off my chest.
I finally wrote about home/hospital birth (I don't have children yet so I kind of felt a little uncomfortable expressing my opinions) on my blog: http://lifeofcarla.blogspot.com/2010/09/home-birth-why-i-think-its-awesome.html
And I keep finding more information to link to! Don't know if that's sad or good.
Oh, and I wanted to mention that the October edition of Parent's Magazine (horrible rag, but it seems that our subscription may never end) had a blurb about the new ACOG standard for VBACs. It didn't sy it was a new standard, but stated that ACOG said labor is okay with VBA up to 2 C's, twins, unknown scars (I think the list is directly from the ACOG letter and I'm paraphrasing here). It then went on to temper the message with a general admonishment to check with your OB to make sure they were on the same page. Frustrating and a little strange. It was located on the "Health" page, adjacent to a blurb about "tanorexia" :/
Dana, I love it when news about childbirth ends up in the "Strange News" or "Oddities" section. And, no, they will never stop sending you that magazine.
Your first comment is so interesting. Someday I hope you'll write a post. What you said matches up with Cheryl Beck's work on PTSD stemming from childbirth...
Birth trauma is an event that occurs during any phase of the childbearing process than involves actual or threatened serious injury or death to the mother or her infant. The trauma can be classified as a negative outcome, such as a postpartum hemorrhage, or psychological distress. Experiencing this extremely traumatic stressor, a woman’s response can be intense fear, helplessness, loss of control, and horror. (2008)
Heather,
Medicalized birth lends itself to misogyny in that it reflects society’s beliefs about women, pregnancy and babies. Overstating risks to patients in order to affect behavior is obviously dishonest and coercive, which means that women are stripped of agency in decision-making. When a woman walks into the hospital, it is often assumed that she can’t give birth without an epidural (or cesarean) right from the get-go. There is a tendency in the medical setting to ignore the woman and hone right in on the fetus with the expectation that the woman will consent to invasive medical procedures for the perceived benefit to the fetus (see the part above about overstating risk). The one-size-fits-all factory efficiency model can dehumanize women (and all patients, honestly).
On the flip side, women worked hard to get drugs for relief in labor and most of those drugs are in the hospital and need to be used under medical supervision (or administered by an anesthesiologist). Maternal and infant mortality improved because of access to obstetric care, so that would make it very pro-woman. Denying a woman pharmaceutical pain relief in labor is very weird, and if hospital birth was not available, epidurals and spinals would not be available to those who want them. That sounds like a misogynistic plan to me, especially since midwifery and trained labor support from other females almost fell by the wayside in the last century.
It depends a lot on the flexibility of policies, dominant philosophy and culture of hospital staff/admin, and expressed patient preferences.
What you’re talking about drives me bananas. I’ve written before about how people reacted to me not getting an epidural. Friends and random people who happened to hear “no epidural” (I guess it came up in conversation? New moms chatting?) jumped to the conclusion that I was a superhero that had just climbed Mt. Everest barefoot. I went through a long period of cognitive dissonance because of how my account of my birth was received and how I perceived it (very painful, bad narcotics reaction, undue stress from staff but ultimately no big deal… it was a vaginal birth without an epidural, which happens around the clock all over the world). People are inherently weird and judgmental when it comes to childbirth.
Actually, Most Fruitful Yuki's logo is quite clever. I had greatly considered doing something similar a while back, but of course I never got around to implementing my idea. Hey, at least I got around to implementing my HBA2C, right? ;)
I have been dying to ask this question for a while. I'm at that age where my friends are all getting married and starting to have babies. My husband and I are starting to think about having kids as well. We're set on having a homebirth (barring an emergency, of course), after educating ourselves about the pitfalls of the "active management" approach to birth in most hospitals.
But as I look at my friends who are becoming mothers, I can see that most of them haven't thought about their options at all, and are being steered toward really abusive situations with their doctors. (One is having ultrasounds every other week because she's "at risk of being high-risk"-- WTF does that mean?!? Another broke my heart at a baby shower when she tried to laugh through clearly teary eyes about how many times she had her cervix checked--painfully-- during her induction, which ultimately failed and led to a c-section.) As someone who's never had kids, and who doesn't want to come across as preachy or like I'm pushing my views on others, I have no idea what to say when this stuff comes up. But I also feel like I'm being a bad friend if I don't alert them to the fact that they have options, and that what is happening (slash has happened) to them is NOT an inevitable part of the birthing experience.
How (if at all) do you folks broach the subject of making informed choices in childbirth with less-informed friends and family?
"Maternal and infant mortality improved because of access to obstetric care, so that would make it very pro-woman."
Weell....not until Lister's principles of hygiene were implemented and doctors stopped doing exams right after dissecting corpses and not washing their hands.
I think every article that tells us how many lives obstetrics saves now should be required to tell the story of Ignatz Semmelweis first. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis
I think about that story a lot whenever someone tries to tell me how their (induced) baby might've died if not for the OB...
"As someone who's never had kids, and who doesn't want to come across as preachy or like I'm pushing my views on others, I have no idea what to say when this stuff comes up." (Sabi)
Well, I have had kids and I blog on the topic and I still have no idea what to say. I listen, mostly. If someone comes to me because they're curious about midwifery or birth centers or refusing a cesarean, I'll answer questions about my personal experience and that's it.
At risk of being high-risk? Huh?
Sabi--you kind of have to feel your way. Everyone's receptiveness is going to be different. And in the end, you can only really change what you do. You might put your friend who had the traumatic c/s in touch with ICAN, or just let her talk, if she needs to.
There are lots of good sources for birth trauma, and on the ICAN website, too.